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Locked: SSF4:AE PC ONLINE QUESTION
13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:09PM #91
SHREDDER
Posts: 994

i am sure capcom will not let this happen. they are not so stupid to use such a drm like this. maybe sven meant that it need to be connected online for activation only... there is not way they are going to use a drm like ubisoft

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:11PM #92
Andre
Posts: 185

May 26, 2011 -- 1:05PM, Ice_Breaker wrote:


You guys do not have Wi-Fi connections on public places?


lol


Here almost every place offers wi-fi for the customers. Even McDonalds.





Yeah In your country...


What If I says there's many here user who don't have a wifi connections on public places like...me 


don't think if you country have many wifi connection other country have the same access is not the same...we have different culture and technology...


wifi in my country is being limited access sometime we can online but some specific website being blocked access...even with slow connection how about that...If you Capcom how do you handle this situation?

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:14PM #93
Mike
Posts: 467

I will definetly buy the game. I`just don`t agree with their "anti-pirate method" decission. And what i dislike the most is that capcom is still giving us a boot in the backside for being patient and loyal to their merchandise. But if the console version differenciates from the pc version of AE in terms of DRM and anti-pirating BS, then i will not think twice about continiously supporting a company which will only degradate one part of the gaming scene due to their old mentality. Namely PC. I am so sick of this. If sven would confirm the so called "full price demo retail you bought dlc but don`t have owning rights offline version" to my misunderstanding of things all fine and dandy. But if it`s the real thing then i will not continue wasting money on a company that doesn`t take pleas from one of the plattforms they seem to want to walk forward with and grow. This will be my last game. Even as a huge fan of the fighting game genre, i will draw the line.

Please join this thread and show your interest for a PC release of UMvsC 3.
http://capcom-unity.com/marvelvscapcom/go/thread/view/102977/28044181/UMvsC_3_PC_release_request_thread

GFWL: gluemchen
GAMES: SSF IV:AE(PC), BB:CT(PC), DA:O(PC), Minecraft
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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:25PM #94
Ice_Breaker
Posts: 120

May 26, 2011 -- 1:09PM, SHREDDER wrote:


i am sure capcom will not let this happen. they are not so stupid to use such a drm like this. maybe sven meant that it need to be connected online for activation only... there is not way they are going to use a drm like ubisoft





Yeah. Like I said in my previously post, I think we need to wait for Sven or Capcom to clarify all this situation.


The first post from him in this thread is still a bit confusing:


May 25, 2011 -- 6:32PM, Sven wrote:


May 25, 2011 -- 6:19PM, PurpleAkuma wrote:


Im a bit confused about this also but I think what he means is its  15/39 ONLY if you are using an offline GFWL profile. Pirates can do that  and I guess that's to restrict them from features until they buy the  game and register it online.


Interesting anti piracy concept. It might work actually.





Correct. Only 15 of the 39 player characters will be selectable if  you aren't authenticated (not just offline account).  We preferred doing  this rather than not having any playable experience offline (which many  other games do).


 




In this post from Sven, What I understand is that only the OFFLINE accounts will be "punished". ONLINE accounts will be able to play normally even while offline.


For those who don't know, in GFWL "ONLINE ACCOUNTS" are not the same of "CONNECTED ON INTERNETZ RIGHT NOW ACCOUNTS", but  "ACCOUNTS THAT ARE ALREADY LEGITIMATELY ACTIVATED ONLINE AND NOW CAN ENJOY ALL THIS AMAZING GAME WITHOUT ANY PROBLEM".

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:28PM #95
Artur
Posts: 34

I hope Sven comes back soon and clarifies this. This is becoming a PR nightmare for Capcom and I want to buy this game to play mostly offline without worries. A one-time activation would be perfectly fine for me and everyone else, I reckon.


We need clarification.

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 1:54PM #96
wiseguy
Posts: 11

agreed, sven please clear this up for us.


 


 

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 2:05PM #97
Sven
Posts: 8,847

I understand there's some very strong opinions here and around the net. 


Let me ask a few questions of the users here and perhaps we can come to a better solution for all folks involved. What I'm proposing is a constructive dialog and I'll take this feedback back to the team. 


But first some ground rules for this discussion to be constructive:


Any posts dealing with complaints about GFWL will be summarily ignored and/or deleted depending upon the language used. That is a non-negotiable point at this point in development and it's not constructive to make that an issue. We have used GFWL with no problems on several releases and it works great on SSFIV:AE.


Any posts outright dismissing the need for DRM of some form are also not feasible, especially given the history with SFIV. Sorry, but that's another reality in which we live. Blizzard and Valve both use DRM in their games... and when they do have offline forms, they have reduced functionality/features. This is not new or exclusive in any way to Capcom.


Now, that said, it is in no way our intention to punish legitimate users. That's definitely not the purpose here. It is to attempt to ensure that our content is only enjoyed fully by legitimate users.


Question 1: Without using a secure network authentication mechanism of some kind (SSA, Steam CEG, Impulse GOO, SecuROAM, etc.) how can we validate that a copy is legitimate versus pirated? 


Question 2: If it isn't what we've proposed, what form of limitations would be acceptable in the event that there in a "non trusted" mode, assuming that it can be secured?


Question 3: If there were a network validated install and we put in an offline mode that would allow you to have functionality for some period of time, but require revalidation on a frequent interval, would that be acceptable?


Question 4: There seems to be a lot of supposition that the pirates will instantly crack whatever protections we put in place. One never knows, that could well be true. Personally, I'm not quite as defeatist. One at least has to try. Now, if we promised to "sunset" those protections in the event of a crack being created so that legitimate users don't have a substandard experience to pirates, is that an acceptable solution?


Happy to hear any other proposed solutions that could work and I'll see what we can do with the team.


Christian Svensson
Corporate Officer/Senior Vice-President

Now Playing:  SW: The Old Republic (PC), Kid Icarus (3DS), Spiral Knights (PC), Dota2 (PC), League of Legends (PC), Rayman (Vita)

You can find me on Google+
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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 2:11PM #98
Lux
Posts: 219

The "3" and "4" are acceptable for me.


By Deva Princess
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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 2:13PM #99
Ice_Breaker
Posts: 120

Sven, I suggest that you limit all the game modes, except the Versus mode.


So, when offline, we can play versus mode normally with all the characters and features.

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13 months ago  ::  May 26, 2011 - 2:22PM #100
Artur
Posts: 34

Thank you for getting in touch with us, the PC community, Sven, we appreciate it. Before I reply to your questions a small clarification.


May 26, 2011 -- 2:05PM, Sven wrote:

Blizzard and Valve both use DRM in  their games... and when they do have offline forms, they have reduced  functionality/features.



Correct about Blizzard and Battle.net, Steam however allows you to play offline without penalties if the game can be played offline. This isn't a criticism to anything, just a clarification, nothing more.


For your questions:


Question 1: Without using a secure network authentication mechanism of  some kind (SSA, Steam CEG, Impulse GOO, SecuROAM, etc.) how can we  validate that a copy is legitimate versus pirated?


I don't think anyone here is against SSA or any kind of DRM to validate a copy. To be honest I will be fine with a check validation to validate that my copy is, indeed, legal. From what I've read in the posts here in this thread I don't think anyone is against SSA or a check-validation of the game.


Question 2: If it isn't what we've proposed, what form of limitations  would be acceptable in the event that there in a "non trusted" mode,  assuming that it can be secured?


I think GFWL have patched the way pirates could use a key from a legit game to play any GFWL game online. Taking away the online component is a limitation but I think you mean making a limitation offline for copies that are not legit. Honestly, I think the 15 characters, no setting saves, no achievements restrictions offline would be fine for a pirated copy. You could even limit it to 2 characters, it could serve as a very restrictive demo in a way and if you wanted to play more than, say, 2 characters buy the game. I think the problem that everyone is complaining here is that this DRM is hitting us, who want to buy the game, and not the pirates and it should be the other way around. After GFWL does a valid check that our key, our game copy is legal and valid, we, paying customers, should have no restrictions offline. If GFWL checks that a pirated copy is pirated and illegal, put these restrictions into place. In fact, if you want to go even further, only allow the benchmark tool to work in a pirated copy offline.


Question 3: If there were a network validated install and we put in an  offline mode that would allow you to have funtionality for some period  of time, but require revalidation on a frequent interval, would that be  acceptable?


Depends on the interval. If it was, say, once or twice a month I personally wouldn't be against the DRM. I think, as a general rule, people don't mind a regular check as long as it's spaced apart by a good period of time, once or twice a month for instance. It would also be important for us, the users, to know when the check happens too so we can connect to the net for the check to occur.


Question 4: There seems to be a lot of supposition that the pirates will  instantly crack whatever protections we put in place. One never knows,  that could well be true. Personally, I'm not quite as defeatist. One at  least has to try. Now, if we promised to "sunset" those protections in  the event of a crack being created so that legitimate users don't have a  substandard experience to pirates, is that an acceptable solution?


Yes, it would, though if the DRM remains as it is it would punish both the pirates and legitimate users and that's not fair, I think. There's also other concerns. Let's say the pirates never crack it, what guarantees do gamers have that one day years from now the DRM stops working and we no longer have access to the game? Or, for instance, if the GFWL authentication servers have an outage and we get locked out of the game, both online and offline? It wouldn't be fair to us, paying customers, to be on the mercy of external factors just to open the game.


 


I will state that I don't mind GFWL as I don't mind Steam. Never had a problem with GFWL so I don't mind it. I think that the DRM should hit the pirates, not us. If you don't mind me say so, create a DRM that punishes the pirates without punishing us while at the same time allows the pirate to have a glance, even if brief, at how the game is to encourage them to buy the game. I think punishing us who will happily buy your game, however, is wrong since we have done nothing wrong. By punishing us the DRM creates the feeling in us that we are the ones doing something wrong when that is very far from the truth.


If the DRM actually did the offline restrictions to the pirates instead of us who have bought the game I think everyone would be happy. Heck, go wild on the restrictions! As I've said, you could even go as far as allow only the benchmark to work! But please, please, don't punish us who are happy and willing to buy your game for the things we did not and will not do.

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